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The Ketchum Report

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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  SasquaiNation on Mon Sep 03, 2012 5:09 pm

Sorry your not really comparing apples to apples in these things

I think that's the entire point of this topic. Dr. Sykes is far more qualified than Dr. Ketchum. Dr. Sykes doesn't say what journal will publish him, so that's speculation to assume Oxford will publish. It may or may not be the case.
Ketchum and Sykes are both doing DNA studies and if Ketchum had her study in order she would likely have been published by now. Dr. Ketchum charged plenty of money to those who sent her their samples to be tested, so she is funded as well.
Dr. Sykes has to be up front because he is a scientist, not because the University funds the project.




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Academia takes care of it's own!

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 5:33 pm

Dr. Ketchum is going up against a formidable opponent with Dr. Sykes. However, He got this idea from Melba! I fear Sykes blocking Melba's DNA report so that he gets the credit for the discovery first. Why do I think this? Because Academia is the Bedrock of journal articles, thus they have greatest pull with the journals because they are the heart and soul of these articles, they "manage" what is published, and Sykes could ***delay*** her work until his DNA work is published. Academia is the heart and soul of these journals, and the "Publish or Perish" motto is no joke among that esteemed group of academia, especially if they are connected to Oxford. Sykes study is due out in November, we are already into September. Why is no one taking this issue seriously among the Ketchum camp? I raised this issue with Melba and was "poo-pooed" for being concerned. I grew up in Academia. My dad was the Dean of the School of Pharmacy at Sanford University for 30 years. Google Dr. Woodrow Robert Byrum, my dad, to see why I know what I'm talking about. I pray that Melba manages to publish first, especially since Sykes got the idea from Melba; however, Sykes has power that Melba does not have. Hopefully we will see Melba's DNA published this month as I have been reassured this will happen, of course, I was reassured every month for the past 9 months by the Ketchum group so I'm not holding my breath.
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Re:Academia takes care of it's own!

Post  SasquaiNation on Mon Sep 03, 2012 5:46 pm

You may be correct in certain aspects of Academia, but I doubt Dr. Sykes would try to block Dr. Ketchum. I don't see that he has any reason to from my perspective.
I honestly can't see Dr. Ketchum publishing before Dr. Sykes does, simply because Dr. Sykes is far more experienced and he has given the public a timeline. It's a very professional and no nonsense way of handling it.
I'm glad you're not holding your breath. I pulled the fish hook out of my mouth a long time ago.

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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  StankApe on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:10 pm

g


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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:12 pm

Dr. Sykes may not be blocking Melba, but he could be helping to delay her journal release date for 2 reasons, one reason is so he could be first, or Sykes will publish around the same time, and due to his professional stature, his release will garner more publicity than Melba's would.
Oxford declares that Sasquatch is real versus local vet claims Yeti is real. I suspect Sykes will garner more press coverage. Having Oxford backing the reality of Sasquatch from a professor working there beats a veterinarian's claim to the same news. I just hope that Melba's work is published first. Melba thought of this DNA and video proof of the reality of this species and Dr. Sykes took her idea and has run with it. I sincerely hope that Dr. Ketchum will receive the honor of proving this species is real first.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:17 pm

StankApe wrote:seems a bit extreme to start making conspiratorial accusations against Sykes when the far more likely idea is that she either has no paper submitted or did a lousy job of it.

Melba has done the work, she has been delayed due to rewrites being needed according to the journal's editors. I sincerely hope that I am wrong, and that Melba will be published first. I'm hopeful that we will be seeing her DNA report within the next couple of weeks; then Dr. Sykes' DNA report will support and backup Melba's efforts.That would be a fair and honorable outcome.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  SasquaiNation on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:30 pm

Melba thought of this DNA and video proof of the reality of this species and Dr. Sykes took her idea and has run with it

I think you may be incorrect that Melba thought of this. From what I've read, she was approached by N.A.B.S. Doesn't the Erickson and Olympic Projects have samples being tested as well? She was the only person around at the time that would agree to handle this type of study. She may have been first, but she didn't think of it.
Also, from what I've read, people are taking their samples to be tested elsewhere.

If I'm wrong on what I've stated, I'd be happy to read anything you may have that shows otherwise.

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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  StankApe on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:31 pm

g


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It's fun to make assumptions...we all do it...but let's wait and see

Post  ***** on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:37 pm

We just don't have insight into what's really going on. Before we attack the credibility and character of those involved, I think we should be more generous. It's inflammatory to attack a person's character, or credibility without having details. That goes both ways.

So many assumptions, so little backup.

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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  CMcMillan on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:38 pm

SasquaiNation wrote:
Sorry your not really comparing apples to apples in these things

I think that's the entire point of this topic. Dr. Sykes is far more qualified than Dr. Ketchum. Dr. Sykes doesn't say what journal will publish him, so that's speculation to assume Oxford will publish. It may or may not be the case.
Ketchum and Sykes are both doing DNA studies and if Ketchum had her study in order she would likely have been published by now. Dr. Ketchum charged plenty of money to those who sent her their samples to be tested, so she is funded as well.
Dr. Sykes has to be up front because he is a scientist, not because the University funds the project.





Actually He will be Publishing with Oxford. He works for Oxford he will publish in an Oxford Journal since his research is At Oxford. He may get picked up in another journal but his Primary one will be one of the Oxford ones which are for Professors of Oxford to publish and retain their tenure. He isn't going to be publishing in the Harvard or Cornell Journals I also doubt he will be publishing in the Liebert journals.
Then the next question will it be in a DNA journal.
yes he has to be upfront because the University is paying him to. And he most likely has Grad and undergrade Students doing work with him, so he has to supply an outline and a time frame for their education and the school. it has nothing to do with him being a scientist that he has to be up front.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  CMcMillan on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:40 pm

StankApe wrote:But you accusation makes no sense..... Nature doesn't care what some other scientist is up to. if the rumor even got around that they held up a paper so another scientist could get first publication, they would lose the large amount of prestige they have built up over the years as THE preeminent journal for scientific publication.

Which seems more likely? That a major journal would risk their reputation and perhaps their entire business by waiting to publish Sykes first? Or that Ketchum's paper is either not up to snuff or doesn't exist?

Stank,
Define major Journal?
this one?
http://www.liebertpub.com/DNA

I can tell you that if the Peer review and the Research is sound it will be published regardless of here supposed rep.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  StankApe on Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:05 pm

g


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Now hold on Stank....

Post  ***** on Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:35 pm

"when the far more likely idea is that she either has no paper submitted or did a lousy job of it."

I understand your respect for Sykes, and his credentials deserve such. I have great hopes for his study, and appreciate his transparency in the process.

Cm, is right about his requirements to be that way, however, and Ketchum is under different requirements, with an NDA.

You seem to question Ketchum's qualifications, and credibility. I think that's premature, and based on assumption and rumor.

That's what you accuse Susi of, in what preceded the quote above. Is she more presumptive than yourself?


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Dr. Ketchum claims the Nature group is not publishing her report.

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:39 pm

Dr. Ketchum has stated that the Nature group et al is not publishing her report. I don't know who may be publishing it. All I know is that Melba refers to a "journal" coming out soon. Question I have no clue who is publishing the report.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  StankApe on Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:46 pm

g


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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:07 pm

[quote="StankApe"]I do question her qualifications relative to Sykes(she's a vet who's lab does pedigree verification, and he's an eminent PHD who has been published and cited multiple times), and due to the (and you gotta admit this ) rather screwy way her study has gone down.

Maybe she has good data, I have no idea. But the manner in which her study has progressed, it looks bad.

If you want to see how studies and publication work in the real world of science, look at the Sykes paper. updates, timelines, no secrecy......


I understand your concerns and the problems regarding the Ketchum Report. This may or may not be Melba's first time to be published, but it is the *first time* to be published in a big name journal. My heart goes out to her since she came up with this idea, and has worked hard to bring this species out into the light where they can be protected by laws. Melba has been working on this for at least a year. I do respect Dr. Sykes, he will do an excellent job, but I hope that Dr. Ketchum's study will be published soon so that the BF can have laws passed to protect them ASAP. Due to my background my heart is with Academia, but Melba was the first person to give me hope that the Sasquatch could be officially recognized through science and thus protected. Vets have doctorates of veterinary sciences, plus she has extra DNA training. Ph.Ds (depending on the field) can have more college time, yet Ph.Ds and Vets have around the same amount of post grad training IIRC. They both obtain Doctorates degrees upon graduation. I wish Dr. Sykes well, and I hope that both studies will prove conclusively that Sasquatch lives thus leading to laws being passed to protect them.
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Thanks Susi

Post  ***** on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:15 pm

I just wanted you to know that we appreciate you posting here, and welcome any future insight or shared information you can provide on the Ketchum study.

There are a lot of people here who have still have confidence in Melba Ketchum, and we are patiently waiting for her results and published results.


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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:24 pm

StankApe wrote:I do question her qualifications relative to Sykes(she's a vet who's lab does pedigree verification, and he's an eminent PHD who has been published and cited multiple times), and due to the (and you gotta admit this ) rather screwy way her study has gone down.

NDA's? Creating societies (with her as the director of course), multiple claims of 'soon", the "habituation trip".... None of these things are what a scientists trying to get published would be doing. It's really a glaring example of her lack of qualifications and knowledge that all this has taken place.

Maybe she has good data, I have no idea. But the manner in which her study has progressed, it looks bad.

If you want to see how studies and publication work in the real world of science, look at the Sykes paper. updates, timelines, no secrecy......



as far as saying I'm doing the same thing as Susi, I totally disagree. She made the accusation that a Journal would conspire with a PHD (at great risk to both of their reputations) to either reject/hold back another persons paper so that the other could get first publication.... The ethical ramifications of such a claim are pretty serious stuff, and I see no evidence or reason for both to take such a risk.

On the other hand, Ketchum's problems are pretty obvious to everyone (believers and skeptics alike) she HAS mismanaged it, she HAS made rather eyebrow raising claims, she HAS hired a publicist and then taken down her facebook page, while both ignoring honest questions and/or replying only "soon". None of these things are the way scientists do things when they are doing studies. She keeps cancelling lecture dates at footer events, Sykes went on the Today show....

I do not believe that a journal is delaying Melba's DNA project, nor do I believe that Sykes is in collusion with a respected journal to delay anything. Sykes has lived in academia, Ketchum has not and has had to learn how it works through trial and error. I'm thankful that there will be 2 studies proving this species exists coming from 2 different sources.
Melba has had to learn the hard way how this all works, plus try to keep her lab up and running to support herself. This delay has been and is hard for all of us who have been waiting for it's release since last December 2011. I guess that I'm rooting for the underdog in this case. Melba is not perfect, nor does she probably have the credentials Dr. Sykes has, yet she has managed to put this DNA project together, and have it pass peer review.
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Thank You Noble Savage

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:30 pm

NobleSavage wrote:I just wanted you to know that we appreciate you posting here, and welcome any future insight or shared information you can provide on the Ketchum study.

There are a lot of people here who have still have confidence in Melba Ketchum, and we are patiently waiting for her results and published results.

I love you Thank you so much. I also have faith in Melba having her report published soon finally proving the existence of Sasquatch. Melba has worked so hard to put this DNA project together, and I sincerely wish her well.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  CMcMillan on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:37 pm

StankApe wrote:I do question her qualifications relative to Sykes(she's a vet who's lab does pedigree verification, and he's an eminent PHD who has been published and cited multiple times), and due to the (and you gotta admit this ) rather screwy way her study has gone down.


Maybe she has good data, I have no idea. But the manner in which her study has progressed, it looks bad.

If you want to see how studies and publication work in the real world of science, look at the Sykes paper. updates, timelines, no secrecy......




The other issue you are dealing with is all the "Rumors" that are going around the whole DNA / Seirra Killing issues.
Sykes has no NDA with anyone that we know of.
Ketchum has a NDA with someone, which I am not sure who it is. We also have several people waiting to do Books and OR Documentries based off Ketchums and Sykes studies. We also know that at least the Seirra Killing Stuff went to Two other Labs.
I would think all around the 4 Labs is good. If all the labs come up with the same DNA results it adds more to the Validity of the creature and the shooting.
Now since we are not inside the Ketchum research lab, we know from "Rumors" and the "Buzz" that she is heavily into setting up a protetion for these creatures.
Like is said their are many journals that anyone of these things can be sent too.
DNA, veterinary sciences, Primate Science .etc.....
So many Journals it could be in so i wouldn't even bother guessing to which it would be in.
We don't know Ketchum, and making General statements that she isn't a scientist like Sykes is your opinion.
What if Sykes delays would you then have to eat your words about how A good scientist would do.
"If you want to see how studies and publication work in the real world of science, look at the Sykes paper. updates, timelines, no secrecy......"
Really does he give an exact date when its published? Is he showing his results right now? Are we getting to see the paper as it is written? Really this again is your Opinion and its not accurat since their will be secrecy on things. They have to or we wouldn't want to read the paper. Why hasn't he show pictures of the samples he has had?
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I promise all of you..

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:38 pm

The second I hear that the journal is out I'll come here and publish where you can read the news, or see it on TV news broadcasts. I will come here to this forum first and share the event with all of you who are online here. I love you
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  CMcMillan on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:40 pm

Sweetsusiq wrote:
StankApe wrote:I do question her qualifications relative to Sykes(she's a vet who's lab does pedigree verification, and he's an eminent PHD who has been published and cited multiple times), and due to the (and you gotta admit this ) rather screwy way her study has gone down.

NDA's? Creating societies (with her as the director of course), multiple claims of 'soon", the "habituation trip".... None of these things are what a scientists trying to get published would be doing. It's really a glaring example of her lack of qualifications and knowledge that all this has taken place.

Maybe she has good data, I have no idea. But the manner in which her study has progressed, it looks bad.

If you want to see how studies and publication work in the real world of science, look at the Sykes paper. updates, timelines, no secrecy......



as far as saying I'm doing the same thing as Susi, I totally disagree. She made the accusation that a Journal would conspire with a PHD (at great risk to both of their reputations) to either reject/hold back another persons paper so that the other could get first publication.... The ethical ramifications of such a claim are pretty serious stuff, and I see no evidence or reason for both to take such a risk.

On the other hand, Ketchum's problems are pretty obvious to everyone (believers and skeptics alike) she HAS mismanaged it, she HAS made rather eyebrow raising claims, she HAS hired a publicist and then taken down her facebook page, while both ignoring honest questions and/or replying only "soon". None of these things are the way scientists do things when they are doing studies. She keeps cancelling lecture dates at footer events, Sykes went on the Today show....

I do not believe that a journal is delaying Melba's DNA project, nor do I believe that Sykes is in collusion with a respected journal to delay anything. Sykes has lived in academia, Ketchum has not and has had to learn how it works through trial and error. I'm thankful that there will be 2 studies proving this species exists coming from 2 different sources.
Melba has had to learn the hard way how this all works, plus try to keep her lab up and running to support herself. This delay has been and is hard for all of us who have been waiting for it's release since last December 2011. I guess that I'm rooting for the underdog in this case. Melba is not perfect, nor does she probably have the credentials Dr. Sykes has, yet she has managed to put this DNA project together, and have it pass peer review.

Thank you,
This is the exact Issues Melba is running a business while Skyes is a Professor working at a college big difference in the world of research. Skyes has gotten a lot of funding to do his DNA testing while I am sure Melba has not. Skyes also most likely has a bunch of UnderGrads and Grads working on the project for credit. Where Melba's people are not. Big Differences.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  Sweetsusiq on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:49 pm

CMcMillan wrote:
Sweetsusiq wrote:
StankApe wrote:I do question her qualifications relative to Sykes(she's a vet who's lab does pedigree verification, and he's an eminent PHD who has been published and cited multiple times), and due to the (and you gotta admit this ) rather screwy way her study has gone down.

NDA's? Creating societies (with her as the director of course), multiple claims of 'soon", the "habituation trip".... None of these things are what a scientists trying to get published would be doing. It's really a glaring example of her lack of qualifications and knowledge that all this has taken place.

Maybe she has good data, I have no idea. But the manner in which her study has progressed, it looks bad.

If you want to see how studies and publication work in the real world of science, look at the Sykes paper. updates, timelines, no secrecy......



as far as saying I'm doing the same thing as Susi, I totally disagree. She made the accusation that a Journal would conspire with a PHD (at great risk to both of their reputations) to either reject/hold back another persons paper so that the other could get first publication.... The ethical ramifications of such a claim are pretty serious stuff, and I see no evidence or reason for both to take such a risk.

On the other hand, Ketchum's problems are pretty obvious to everyone (believers and skeptics alike) she HAS mismanaged it, she HAS made rather eyebrow raising claims, she HAS hired a publicist and then taken down her facebook page, while both ignoring honest questions and/or replying only "soon". None of these things are the way scientists do things when they are doing studies. She keeps cancelling lecture dates at footer events, Sykes went on the Today show....

I do not believe that a journal is delaying Melba's DNA project, nor do I believe that Sykes is in collusion with a respected journal to delay anything. Sykes has lived in academia, Ketchum has not and has had to learn how it works through trial and error. I'm thankful that there will be 2 studies proving this species exists coming from 2 different sources.
Melba has had to learn the hard way how this all works, plus try to keep her lab up and running to support herself. This delay has been and is hard for all of us who have been waiting for it's release since last December 2011. I guess that I'm rooting for the underdog in this case. Melba is not perfect, nor does she probably have the credentials Dr. Sykes has, yet she has managed to put this DNA project together, and have it pass peer review.

Thank you,
This is the exact Issues Melba is running a business while Skyes is a Professor working at a college big difference in the world of research. Skyes has gotten a lot of funding to do his DNA testing while I am sure Melba has not. Skyes also most likely has a bunch of UnderGrads and Grads working on the project for credit. Where Melba's people are not. Big Differences.

All of the helpers are unpaid volunteers who willingly devote their time to this Protect the Sasquatch cause. Melba has to work plus deal with the DNA project. Frankly, I don't know how she does it.
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Re: The Ketchum Report

Post  Mr.Lee on Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:23 am

Shocked follow the money


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National Geographic Corporation on a Bigfoot media project

Post  CMcMillan on Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:15 am

From Robert Lindsey

http://robertlindsay.wordpress.com/2012/09/04/bigfoot-news-september-3-2012/

Dr. Melba Ketchum is working with National Geographic Corporation on a Bigfoot media project. This is great news, and I am 100% certain, given the source, that it is true.

This was originally reported me that “National Geographic” was the name of the journal she had submitted to, and that National Geographic was part of the Nature Group. However, National Geographic is not part of the Nature Group, and National Geographic at any rate is not a peer-reviewed journal; instead it is more of a popular magazine. I was also told to look for a journal associated with National Geographic, but there are none.

In addition, I was told to fish around with sources associated with National Geographic try to flesh out more about this. I don’t know anyone associated with National Geographic, so I can’t do that. But I will just throw this out to the Bigfoot community. If you can dredge up any sources associated with National Geographic, you may be able to elaborate on this scoop, which I am 100% certain is true.

What I find intresting is National Geographic T.V. is doing a Bigfoot show on Mystery 360 on the 7th of this month

Mystery 360: Bigfoot
What evidence do we have that Bigfoot may actually exist? A team of investigators will assess the evidence - revealing whats science, and fiction.
Next Showing: Friday 7 September 2012 at 21:00 - National Geographic Channel
Repeats: Saturday 8 September 2012 at 12:30 - National Geographic Channel
Friday 14 September 2012 at 15:15 - National Geographic Channel
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Re: The Ketchum Report

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